Years before my diagnosis I underwent an experience which bears striking similarity to one recalled by Elyn Saks in her book “The Center Cannot Hold”. I was minding my own business as usual when suddenly, completely out of the blue, my sense of “I”, my subjective centre (or “minimal self”), appeared to dissolve completely, leaving me literally paralysed, unable to move. I was no longer “I” and became for a few minutes a “it”. It was a terrifying experience and I had no inkling then that it might be linked to sz.
Have you ever experienced anything like this in the context of sz? Could you expand on this relationship between ego death and schizophrenia?
During my first episode I believe… after roaming from place to place and finally staying by friend. I went through a period that felt like I was on trial… and all my life was read back to me… and I couldn’t really do anything. it went on for several nights and then I had to train my brain to read all over again… because it was like mush. A very low time in my life…
I had a online chat with a guy who talks of being enlightened. He talked of ego death and the death of ‘I’. I answered some other guy’s question about dangers of letting go in meditation.
I replied that it can be dangerous as some people can lose their sense of self forever.
For me, I dissociated for a few weeks where ‘I’ didn’t exist. It was as if I had died and had no awareness of the present, past or foreseeable future. This could be interpreted as some form of enlightenment as it is an ego death of some form.
I said that if dissolving the ego was an aim that it seemed nihilistic because I was no longer alive for all intent and purposes, even though my body and mind existed in some form or other as a separate personality.
If ‘I’ no longer exists then for me dissociated I was as good as dead. The universe continued obviously, but I was not aware of it.
Listening to Mooji to do a meditation recently I felt I could dissociate again, but don’t know if I’ll ever return. Ego death of ‘I’ is a dangerous game in my humble opinion.
But could a spontaneuous experience lasting a few minute of complete and paralysing ego death be explained as being part of sz? Certain drugs and meditation can achieve similar effects, but I’m still not certain if what I experienced can be linked to sz.
Since childhood I had ego death and immersion in pure existence. I was mentally repeating “I exist, I exist” and I was losing small ego, and I was obtaining great Self
Let’s face it, anything out of the ‘normal’ perception range could be described as some form of mental illness in our society; but like you are currently living, functioning and holding ‘alternate’ views can be achieved.
If you tried to explain ego death while holding a religious belief such as a Buddhist philosophy to a psychiatrist who, in general holds a scientific world view then you are on a losing battle.
Personally, having a spontaneous experience that illustrated such a concept is possible.
Having had one and then explaining the scientific method to those that ‘supervise’ us is unnecessary because the death of the ego means that caring about what others think of you doesn’t matter any longer.
Function in society and you can have outlandish ideas and it doesn’t matter anyway, as long as you function.
Maybe a few minutes, maybe 10 or more? I’m really not sure how much time passed.
It felt like reality was spiraling the drain and I had no center to hold on to. I was losing myself and felt like I was dying right then. The only thing I had to cling to was the concept of god, which I did, and continued to do for quite some time. I didn’t believe in god before that moment but when you feel lost and like it’s the end you have to reach out of the dark toward something I suppose.
The sense of myself is the present which is right now as it’s happening. And there’s the reflection of my past memories, present life and future dreams. Losing these things permanently sounds unacceptable.
No. Never happened. I think I have a pretty strong ego, though people see me as weak. I think a lot of negative people, I’m constantly exposed to, would like that to happen.
During one experience I had I was no longer me or limited to my body. I was everything. Omnipresent. I was the trees the ground the sky everything. God If you want to call it.
It was a very frightening experience. I didn’t know what was happening.
I think my ego has been diminished through the vast majority of my life. I have always had very altruistic thoughts, even as a child. I have not stood up for myself and my own interests, and let other people win on the expense of me not arguing anything. I had this idea in my head like real life was almost supposed to be like the sitcom “friends”, where everyone gets along perfectly. I think this way of thinking may have contributed to my psychosis. After meds it got even worse.
Now I’m finding it again though. I am thinking more of myself which is a good thing. Looking out for your own interests is not the same as beeing egoistic. It has taken me a long time to reach this conclusion.
I am not very familiar with the notion of ego-death from meditative practices, but a friend of mine is into that and tells me it is a detachment from your thoughts, emotions and so on to the extent that you just witness them instead of identifying with them. Now I think this can be taken two ways: one as a metacognitive stance towards such occurrences, the other as a pre-reflective primary mode of experience. And I think the meditative practices claim the latter.
I did experience something quite similar to that in the context of schizophrenia, namely an episode of some hours where I would only experience intrusive thoughts and feelings. Most times I experience intrusive thoughts as occasional occurrences intermingled with ordinary thought. This particular episode I did not have a poverty of thought, but all thought and emotion was intrusive. I witnessed thought without identifying with it and in this sense it fits the description of ego-death that my friend offered quite nicely. To me it was terrifying, and I am in doubt whether this is what meditative practices really aim for as something desirable - but perhaps encapsulated in the right practices it can be - or that they are advancing a meta-cognitive stance after all, something that seems a lot more healthy to me.