Canadian health care discussion

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I realize that for many here the Canadian system is viewed as a “gold standard” in that we can have an expensive treatment and not get a bill after. It’s covered by the government (which collects taxes to pay for it). A lot of Americans look north and understandably want this.

The problem is that our health care system is showing some cracks. I was recently in a situation where I needed an ambulance and none was available. Had to be driven to the ER. We’re about 45 minutes from a major centre. Central dispatching means that when the major centre runs out of available ambulances, they suck ours in. From today’s news:

This kid is in the large city that monopolizes my town’s ambulances and is the reason I couldn’t get one when I needed it. Neither could this poor kid. When you can get an ambulance you can still wind up waiting for 10 hours in the ER. And then you get stuck in a hallway for 2 days because no beds are available.

It’s frustrating and also nerve wracking for those of us considered medically fragile. I’m interested in feedback from my fellow Canadians.

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YEah, this is the 2 sides of a coin to healthcare. One one hand, it’s readily available in Canada for everyone. On the other hand it tends to stretch resources thin and increase wait times. I’ve been hearing the two sides of the argument for years when I actually used to listen to this stuff.

Which is better in the end? IDK. You tell me.

P.S. Sorry for chiming in. I know I’m not Canadian.

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yes. i have looked to it as well. aspecially when bill collectors come knocking. i believe that there is an answer in medicare for all. this is what i have now and i don’t pay a cent. i believe the money is there and it is something we could accept to do as a nation. i feel for those who have been where i am even when i’ve had medicare it took a while for poeple to accept it. the poor can’t simply pay for mecial services where i live but it is effecient. i believe it could be both effecient and free for those who can’t the thing is theres so many saying privatize and that you are expected to get your own leg up. they i believe are just wrong.

what do they have in scandaknavian coutnries? i wonder

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Everyone here generally agrees that the care is very good when you get it. The problem is getting access to it. My pacemaker battery came dangerously close to running out before I got a new one. One of my friends developed prostate cancer over a year ago, but they didn’t get him the needed scans until this year. He definitely has prostate cancer. And bone cancer. And liver cancer. And lymphatic cancer. It’s pretty grim. He’s getting good treatment now, but he probably wouldn’t have needed it if he had been able to see a damn doctor over a year ago. Our hospitals were clogged with sick anti-vaxxers who left no resources for legitimately ill people.

This is not a slight against our health care workers. They have gone above and beyond with not nearly enough recognition.

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Also…

Good luck trying to find a family doctor in Canada right now.

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Not to derail this thread and talk about American health care system too much. But I think the working poor and those without income at all are usually are taken care of because of medicaid. The rich are obviously ok, because they can afford health insurance. I think it’s mostly the people in the middle who don’t get medicaid or medicare, who get screwed in our system. I am ok because I get medicare because of disability.

Edit: Sorry about the derail @shutterbug . I will leave it alone now;

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We have “privatized free market” gold star health care here in California - it’s breaking down due to staffing shortages. Especially in mental health. But the whole system is stressed. Pdocs and therapist have cases of 1,000 plus.

Yes @Bowens —— We have a swath of population who just suffer or put off getting medical treatment because they can’t afford insurance so they opt to just get by. A lot of people work and don’t get healthcare. So some of us see Canada and Europe as at least everyone can get to see a doctor.

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The NHS is stressed as well.

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Ow. That’s truly horrific. I want everyone to have access to healthcare, but not like that. Yikes!

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Its ok, some things could be better.
Im No expert.

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Apparently the British NHS in 9th best in the world Finland comes in better than the UK.

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I used to live in Japan and emergency services there suck. It’s a modern country. We weee told not to get in an accident there because no ambulance was coming. And we had to drive on the wrong side of the road.

One of my nephews is in EMT school right now. Dropped out of premed in college. Such a shame because he was a smart student. Could have gone to college anywhere but went here. He had a free ride too. Full scholarship.

EMT is good too though. We need those.

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CANADIAN HERE :canada:

Pick your poison. No system is perfect.

However, going by how much I’ve heard Psychiatric stays in the hospital can cost in the US, upwards of $20,000 for 5 days, I’ll gladly wait in Canada and pay nothing.

I had to wait before being accepted into the mental health facility. Once I was in I was there for 5 months.

Based on the aforementioned costs I’ve heard about in the US that stay would have cost me approximately $720,000. Instead that hospital stay and all my meds have been free…yeah yeah, I know not free, but paid for collectively through other people’s taxes.

Ideally there would be no waiting list, but Id rather wait and suffer a bit, than get out of the hospital with a monster bill I could never pay off.

But it goes both ways, my tax dollars have paid for other people’s hospital visits, surgeries, etc…

That being said there are certain areas that need to be prioritized and invested in where waiting to long can be fatal or result in extreme suffering.

I also don’t have to worry about copays, deductibles or certain doctors not accepting me because they don’t accept my insurance coverage.

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You can’t get into the ones here in AB unless you’re a danger to yourself or others. And then just long enough to be nuked with drugs and rolled back out the door. Everything else is outpatient and handled by the community team. Oh, yeah, they don’t serve my community.

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I’ve only experienced good things with the NHS. Been hospitalised 13 times for MH I also have a very good community nurse I see every 2 weeks (more if needed) and I’ve had him as mu community nurse for 7 years.

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I lived in Alberta for 9 years and am a dual US/Canadian.

There are pros and cons to both systems. I think Canada’s model is better in theory, but not superior in practice.

When I was in Calgary, I lost my family doctor. Went without one for awhile, then lost the second one too. Relied a lot on walk in clinics that were staffed by people who deserved a medal because of how much overload they dealt with every day. So many people in need with nowhere else to go. You could arrive hours ahead of opening and still not get seen. And of course, you’re sick so it’s really hard to bounce around clinics hoping to see a random doctor who doesn’t know you or your history. And won’t follow up with you either. That is no way to do things.

In Lethbridge I went through three family doctors, only one of which was competent. One of them had my husband on 300 mg of Effexor and then told him he could just stop taking it. He had no history of psychosis, just bipolar II but had psychotic episodes cold turkeying off that med. That doc had no business prescribing or discontinuing in that way.

I hurt my back in an almost car accident. Saw the doctor. The MRI took 18 months and then I waited another 6 to see a spine surgeon I had to travel 3 hours away to see, because there were none in my city. Horrible car rides back and forth to see him and then the pain specialist who was giving me four spinal injections at a time. Nothing like riding three hours after that. And of course I couldn’t drive in that situation, so my husband was having to burn his vacation time to take me, for the privilege of listening to me cry all the way there and back. The surgeon said he wouldnt operate but even if he did, it would have been a two year wait. And thats after already waiting 18 months for the MRI and then 6 for my initial surgeon consultation.

The US system has its own huge problem. Im lucky we have excellent insurance, but my husband is stuck in his job because we’d be screwed if we lost it. My psych bills alone would kill us, much less anything else.

I still follow Canadian news daily and I see how badly the system has deteriorated. Those workers left are amazing for sticking with it after the immense burnout that just keeps getting worse. Simply not enough staff. There’s many waiting to help from overseas, but Canada Immigration is backed up for years, so those people can’t get their credentials recognized.

I miss Canada in many ways, but I’m glad im not dealing with the state of the health system now. Especially with as bad as my mental illness has been for the ladt two years. Over a million people in Nova Scotia on a wait list just for a primary doctor. The system just keeps getting worse, and there’s only more shortages in sight, not fixes. You cant graduate replacements fast enough, and those people would have to be crazy to enter that job market.

And as velociraptor said, the problem extends to paramedics as well.

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In Belgium you pay part of the cost. The largest part is Government funded and a part of the cost is payed by the healthcare user. There is also a maximum you have to pay each year so that people don’t go broke over it.

I like the system but I’ve been in mental hospital both in the US and Belgium and hated it in both countries.

Something good in Belgium is that we have a good amount of pdocs. It’s harder to get an appointment with a dentist than a psychiatrist.

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Also, I think the idea of free healthcare has its flaws. It leads to overconsumption as people don’t have to pay for it. Does that make sense?

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I used to live in Canada. I liked Canada’s mental health care system- and as international students have to pay for healthcare, thankfully I was accepted to all programs for mental health care. The tuition is expensive because it includes healthcare fees. I paid healthcare fees every semester with my tuition and Alberta Health takes care of the rest. Technically, I was paying for the mental healthcare I was getting with my tuition.

But what I couldn’t understand was how slow the ER was, and how long you had to wait. In South Korea, waiting doesn’t happen very often and healthcare is very much accessible. You obviously have to pay for it, but you only pay 6 dollars or so per visit because everything else is covered. I pay 60 dollars for 3 months worth of medicine, and psych visits are covered. As a person with multiple health issues, South Korea’s healthcare system is great. But there are always downsides to a healthcare system in general.

South Korea offers very poor mental healthcare programs. Mostly, it’s confined to outpatient visits and there are no support coming from the government or from the community. I’ve never heard of CBT, DBT, etc. or basically any kind of group therapy like I would do in Canada. Also, the poor societal support and competitive society drives one person to commit suicide every 45 seconds in Korea, and yet the government does absolutely nothing to stop suicides. They say they would make a better world, a better place for young people etc but they never do anything. I wish I could find ways to better improve my mental health, but the medical and societal supports are seriously lacking and I wish it was better.

But there are always two sides to what it seems like an excellent healthcare system. Otherwise, I invest about 100 to 200 dollars of medical fees every month. National insurance is 100 dollars per month calculated by taxes. What I hope is for the South Korean government to come up with different treatment programs for people with mental illnesses, so that they could find hope and courage to continue striving for recovery.

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A system that saves more lives is what matters.
25,000 US citizens die annually from lack of Health Insurance.