Helpful voices could be a manifestation of one’s inner altruism, and desire to help others. Like I said, not all of the traits would come from negative aspects of the personality.
I have these periods too. The dopamine can bring out an inspirational, creative side (not just dark aspects).
@Pamito I think that there is something to be said for a subconscious personality array, not just a conscious one. People may have thought of this idea before and been met with rejection- just as you claim that your symptoms have nothing to do with your personality, people (both clinicians and others) may have come up with the idea before and been met with resistance from those who disagree entirely, on the basis that it’s not their “surface” personality. Jung did suggest that schizophrenia was an emergence of subconscious and collective unconscious themes.
@Minnii I don’t think that schizophrenics should treat themselves as saints, as if prior to the illness they had no personality flaws, conscious or subconscious, at all. That would, indeed, be an arrogance stemming from insecurity of those very traits- to claim that we have no negative traits, and therefore it cannot be those manifesting. I agree that arrogance is a response to insecurity. As for guilt behind paranoia, there are traits such as masochism that are manifestations of feeling guilt- one desires punishment to resolve a feeling of guilt. Paranoia (which I think is based more in fear) could be based partially on unresolved guilt manifesting as ideas of persecution.
@Ninjastar I’m learning to incorporate this idea of our experiences/perceptions of events also shaping the way in which our symptoms appear. I used to have critical voices of a certain person until I had a shift in how I perceived the (real) person, after which their voice appeared friendly and helpful.
Neither do I, but I don’t agree with the premisse that delusions come from negative traits of the personality. I think it’s too simplistic.
In my case, I had paranoia about some people, pronoia about other people. So I was feeling guilty and that the same I was arrogant?
Still simplistic. I don’t think a psychological-model-fits-all system ever works in understanding the underlying causes of specific delusions. I think there are specific sets of delusions, brought on by different things depending the individual. Trying to fit everyone on the same wagon, when there’s other wagons around, you have to agree, it’s not the most intelligent thing to do. Not calling you dumb with this at all, you obviously spent quite a time thinking about this.
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But, if you were to say that our traits are amplified during our psychotic breaks I would totally agree with you, I just don’t think they’re the cause of delusions.
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I’d agree with that, but then I think traits don’t cause anything to happen. But I do see some use for traits in making sense of the meaning of delusions, but that’s an individual affair I’d say.
It’s an interesting perspective, I agree. Could the cause be psychological? Why do we have so similar delusions if we’re all different? But from asking the questions to actually give answers goes a long way. You would need an extensive group of people to analise, take conclusions, have a team of psychologists to study it.
some people think the very idea of psychological causation is a mistake.
I don’t know, so I won’t assume I do. I talked to a psychiatrist during my hospitalization that believed all causation is by external stimuli. And it makes sense, we mimic thought patterns since an early age.
I agree. Medication is only a first step towards recovery. Our brains can be taught to re-learn abilities by building new connections and enriching experiences. It takes determination but it can turn things around. Our characters are not set in stone.
I don’t think the traits are the cause of the delusions either- what I’m suggesting is that the delusions are caused by the organic disease of the brain, and that the nature, the qualities, of the delusions are influenced by the personality.
Occam’s Razor, a major scientific tool, is that the simplest explanation for a phenomena is the right one (in almost all cases), and theories tend to become more incorrect as they become more complex.
However, I think it’s important for me to clarify that I am not presenting a conclusion here. I am presenting a practical hypothesis that has personally helped me in my recovery process- as I’ve acknowledged and addressed my defective traits, and worked for their reduction and elimination (and the cultivation of their opposites), I’ve had a change of symptoms as I remain on the same medication. For instance, I used to hear critical, aggressive voices all the time and as I’ve reduced my own antagonism and increased my compassion towards people through action, writing, and meditation, I’ve had negative voices entirely disappear. I only hear complimentary voices that encourage me to be kind and helpful to people now. Big shift- made possible by addressing my own character deficits and transforming them.
This is awesome! This is what you should’ve wrote. And belongs in the recovery category.
The thing is, not all processes work for everyone. I’ve learned that here, what works for me might not work for you and vice versa.
You came on with a theory, with an explanation and I played a bit with the idea. Sorry if I came off as I was demeaning you, was not my intention at all.
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Well I apologize if I was aggressive or insensitive in my presentation of the theory.
You’re right, I should’ve approached this more from a personal recovery standpoint of being a practice based on an idea, rather than presenting it as a broad theory applicable across the board.
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You can still do it, you should really do it, we need more of that here, might work for someone.
I will then- I’ll make a thread about what I practiced, what happened (the mental breakthrough), and what my symptoms are like now, in the hopes that it may benefit someone else. Keep an eye out for it shortly here.
I’m really glad we came to positive terms on this- after I posted my response to you this morning, I felt bad about the way I had handled the topic but I was on my way to work at the Church I attend. I prayed over how I could better express myself positively, and then I read the “lesson” for the day- which ended up being about how to be of service and specifically how to handle difficult conversations. Spot on! My schizophrenic, synchronicity-loving brain got a thrill from that.
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Subconscious can include anything because none of us are aware of how our inner mind is working. Our subconscious can change through input of different stimuli either directly or indirectly, quickly or slowly. Our symptoms we have may have something to do with your theory but grandiosity can come and go and it can stay away forever.
Homosexuality is actually a mental illness, it is a view point and way of life that can’t be changed. Not with therapy or medication. I am not saying homosexuality is a bad thing or a good thing but if you have something that changes your perspective, outlook and desires that cannot be controlled by medication or changing your beliefs and or therapy and isn’t common within the entire population then odds are it is a mental illness.
Ever since society has slowly changed their beliefs on how we perceive and handle homosexuality from being intolerant to more accepting way we slowly removed its classification from an illness into something that “you are born with”… Let’s just say it is more politically correct.
Me being from not so good old Catholic Ireland, my paranoid delusions were about all the other people in my village gossiping about my masturbatory habits. I read years later in a research article that Sz people in Ireland often have delusions about masturbation, which just goes to show that culture (i.e. early programming) has a profound effect on the content of delusions.
Thanks to my Catholic upbringing (which wasn’t of my choosing I might add) and the content of my delusions, I’ve never had a long term girlfriend due to the trauma of my paranoia. I’m now 52 years old. Sad, so sad…