Info about Naben


#21

It just means the technology isn’t there yet. Or rather, not reliably enough yet.

There are other diseases that are real diseases not detected by lab tests, like fibromyalgia or chronic fatigue syndrome. It’s hard for those people because not only are there a lack of treatments, doctors and the public will poo-poo their disease as not real. With these diseases, doctors make the diagnosis by asking questions and treating anything else that could be causing the symptoms.


#22

Outside the declamation prose,the schizophrenia case/cause exists as a malicious conscious entity linking with the human conscious state , has seeks to becomes a part form the human self itself,it means the sz cause is higher living entity in nature look like the thing called (the self),has a specific existential manifest more developed about the existential manifest of the human self “conscious state”,

-A person with sz consist of 2 independent conscious state working by rotation through biochemical processes of single brain,the first is the inherited conscious state for the person,the second for the cause of sz,the issue is higher than you think

  • in order To diagnosis the existential features of sz case inside a person with sz:
    you can have a picture for the skeleton using x-ray,but you can not have a picture for the existential features of the human conscious state (self) by the x-ray

-if we supposed that you have specific x-ray be able to takes a picture for the existential features of the human self,and using it for a person with sz ,you will find that you have 2 pictures
-the first for the human self,the second for the sz cause him/herself !

The current technology is not fit for achieve the picture,add for that all scientific researchers westing the time to search about defective gene or /abnormal biochemical substances in the brain or changes in the anatomical structure…etc ,while the core nature of sz case is a psychological parasitic condition
((please,do not belief me,instead stay waiting the scientific researches along your life to see the impossibility to just diagnosis the sz case/cause and touch draw a blank- manifestations of failure )

in the case,if you see,hear,touch,feel and coexistence with the sz cause,you will perceive that he/she is a living self without body(self no body),has an independent personality,information and the ability to thinking and producing the thoughts,and makes bilateral communication with the conscious state of you through exchange the higher data…etc


#23

Sorry mate but your very hard to understand what your trying to say, I think you should do some more research and you might discover there is no self. And even if there was that would mean your soul has schizophrenia which would make you doomed to live with it forever. Just curious at what your getting at are you suggesting some kind of spiritual healing? Thats the kind of vibe i get from you.


#24

I used to take sodium benzoate and it gave me energy and helped me drive. I stopped taking it because of vitamin C and cancer. I used to drink orange kickstarts and was worried it might interact in my stomach or body. But it did work. It made me a little smarter too. It felt like a mild stimulant at first. I’m glad I tried it but wont be trying it again.


#25

The materialism thinking believe that the material is establishing on duality for a wavy particle in the heart of every thing ,whereas the thing has acts as a wave and sometime as a particle(body/wave).
Material is build on the duality structure ,while you deny the duality for human (body/self- brain/mind --biology/culture),and you guess that the psychological component is public myth
-you belief in the unity of the brains and minds ,the thing so-called “mind” is a full reflection of the brain biochemical functions ,and belief that there is no distinct anatomical structure for something be called a mind in the brain organ
Ok
we will test your materialism thinking to know its credibility
When you classify the schizophrenia as a biological disease,
Then,according to your materialism thoughts,it is supposed that you are able to diagnosis the case/cause/effect and results in the anatomical structure,brain organ,biochemical substance ,the metabolism of schizophrenia …etc

Tell us,why the official methods research of lab are unable to diagnosis the symptoms, disease substance,the cause, the mechanism of actions,the result of reactions in the wholly biological structure ?
-There are actual objective reasons to explain the insufficiency in the diagnostic processes,
because the sz case/cause are exist in the thing that you deny it (the self),it is means the sz occurs in the thing (self) that you think it is a public Myth !

Therefor,it is impossible to diagnosis the sz case/cause/effect in the biological structure ,because sz was embodied and effect in the fantastic myth (self) relatively to your materialism believes.

You have endless years to proof that you can diagnosis the material cause of sz in biological nature,until you achieve that ,all what you say is merely a biological harangue


#26

Today I learned that science doesn’t know the cause of Multiple Sclerosis either.

It’s an autoimmune disease, but they don’t know a clear cause for it.

For that matter, they don’t know a clear cause of Alzheimer’s either.

There are also no single medical tests for Alzheimer’s or MS.


#27

Its not impossible to know the cause of schizophrenia, why do you think there are tens of thousands of people working on it. We are not clueless in the search, science has uncovered a few hints to what the cause is and each day we get closer and closer. With your dualistic view we would never be able to advance medicine so what are you trying to tell me? We should just all give up and pray? Sorry but i put my trust in science and our own capacity to overcome our biological limits.

Edit: Another question I have for you if schizophrenia is not a physical illness why does medicine work?


#28

@insidemind.

Sodium benzoate and vitamin C don’t cause cancer. In one study it did, but that study heated up and cooked sodium benzoate and vitamin C to over 300 degrees. So unless your living on the sun benzoate and vitamin C are just fine. Don’t believe all negative articles online, there mostly written by people who just hear other crap that’s written online.


#29

I feel like my condition is dualistic. I remember past lives, aliens, out of body experiences, etc. My meds mostly work, but dont get rid of these thoughts and memories that come up when I am at a low point. I feel like I’m constantly reincarnating into a parallel universe much like the previous one or inside a computer program.


#30

Yeah i understand that but its most prob just your illness, delusions can do that to you make you believe in things that are not part of reality. I used to have weird delusions too.


#31

At first,I believe in science more than any one,the basic knowledge of nature, the honest reading for data nature, suitable questions, actual objective reasons ,correct analysis…etc

In full trust of what I say ; it is Ultimate Impossible for tens of thousands of people working on Sz research to JUST diagnosis the existential symptom,the potential case,cause structure,effect , types of effect,the mechanism of action or the reactions,the internal phenomena,processes and events that has been occurred inside both of the biological/psychiatric nature.
The results of all scientific research will show you the credibility for every word that be written by me in this forum ,the science that you trust in will show you the impossibility to diagnosis anything regardless the used methods in the researches !!

For tens of thousands of people working in studying the sz by the scientific methods,they have 5-10 years to diagnosis single thing from above ,they will fail because all these things are incorporeal in nature,this nature is outside the capability of the current science ,if you do not belief that,the negative results for all researches will proof that !

The smartness of sz case is that,He/she have the full ability to changing/modifying the mental data forcibly without developing any anatomical changes,abnormal chemical substances or leaving a track in the metabolism,the cause of sz can changes the cognitive life from A to Z of human being without causation a corporeal disease/illness,all these characteristic over the ability of the current science.

If you deal with Sz as a corporeal biological disease,all your conclusions become fatal mistakes !
Simply,if you supposed that ,there is an actual organic disease in the brain , this will lead to blocking/preventing the conscious thought processes,therefore the occurrence of the cognitive changes ( in the religious belief,cultural knowledge,social relationships linkages…etc) does not exist at all in the schizophrenia . (because the disease/damage in the brain will preventing the thinking process, all types of the cognitive processes /or any attempt has seeks to modifying its information ) !!

The actual biological disease will preventing both of ;
1- Running of the natural thinking process itself
2-Modifying the own thoughts (personal knowledge believes) partially or totally ,

In practice each 3 second of waking time there is a possibility to modifying the concept of single thought -AND this means that there is no disease in brain preventing the higher knowledge processes regardless its cultural content !!!

IF schizophrenia is not physical illness,why does medicine work ?
If you answer the next question,you will know the answer of your question

In flu (viral disease),why does medicine work and improving the bad side effects of secondary symptoms,although the medical drugs have no effect on the Virus (the cause of the disease) ?
Disposal the virus depend on the self immunity system not on the antibiotic drugs

In general,the medical drugs able to treatment any symptoms regardless its causes ( like gene/virus/bacteria,poisons or else ),while treatment the basic Cause(root) of the symptoms is different and specialized
(for example,unknown cause causation the heat increasing,you can treatment the symptom whatever the cause- decreasing heat into its natural rate no matter the cause )
in other words,when you treatment the symptoms (only),it is NOT means that you treatment the cause of the symptom (like flu),whereas the symptoms will disappear and the cause of symptoms remain existed

Medical intervention has vital role in the first onset of sz for 2/4 week,whereas the chemical balance of brain becomes in its natural rate ,but that is not a treatment for the cause of sz ,remain existed and practices his functions on the cognitive side without stop or any medical treatment

This means that,even in the existence of brain balance state after 4 week of medication,the person with sz will lives his life under the full effect of sz case in the cognitive side (the whole psychological nature)


#32

If you think that schizophrenia condition in its basic nature is a Biological disease, you belief in without diagnosis biological disease substance ,biological cause , biological effect and biological track of metabolism in the Biological body
This is clear “scientific” delusions can do that to you make you believe in a biological phenomena that are not part of real nature,even if the medical drugs have" cool" effect on the temperament case of the person !
IN OTHER WORDS
in order to believe that the SZ is actual biological condition,you must achieve simple things:
1- diagnosis biological symptoms of SZ in the biological body
2- Diagnosis biological disease substance in the biological body “potential condition”
3- diagnosis a biological features of the cause
4- diagnosis biological effect substances in the biological structure
5- diagnosis biological mechanism processes of the main interactions
6- diagnosis biological results of interaction on the chemical level translated into ;mental,emotional,cognitive,sensory inputs(external factors of the environment), and executive behavior outputs
7- diagnosis biological metabolism tracks
8- Proof that,there is a biological causality relationship between the cause characteristics and everything in above

in the impossibility to achieving all of that, schizophrenia becomes a biological myth (until now )
Treatment a symptoms is not means that ; treat A BIOLOGICAL cause of the disease (if it existed-mainly)
Notice that: the cause itself is not the sums of the symptoms outputs (whatever they are)
in other words: the cause itself is not a symptoms in nature ( for example; gene of debates(cause of disease) is not the sums of the debates symptoms outputs)

look at any person with sz,if you see a biological thing be called symptoms,Sz,cause …etc ,just tell us and we believe you without debate !


#33

You are objective
Please,do not make mistake like others
You said " it’s an autoimmune disease,but they don’t know a clear cause for it "
Only If you find the cause “founder of the disease case”,you can say "it’s an autoimmune disease

the cause itself is the established (originator) of the health condition that we call it a “disease”
in essence,when you find /discover the cause and proof it by science methods, here you can say " it’s autoimmune disease" and this statement becomes a true !
look at most of you,all of you say that ;schizophrenia is a genetic disease, you say that without find/discover the gene who is producing that schizophrenia - it is illogical belief !
Finding the gene itself is the critical point of the issue to definition or not the nature of disease


#34

It’s a disease where the immune system eats away at the myelin coating of nerves, but they don’t know why it does that, so the cause is unknown.

It’s been well established that there is not one, but many (probably hundreds) of associated genes, acting in concert. Some upregulated, some downregulated, some mutated, and not the same between patients, so it’s very complicated. No wonder it is so difficult for science. But new technology may be equal to the task in the next generation.


#35

Thank you for your clear answer,but let me explain the event “disease”,i know what sz is but I do not know the autoimmune disease that you talk about
You were said " it’s a Disease where the immune system eats away at the myelin coating of nerves"
If the meaning of “eats away at” is A eats B
there are 2 possibilities to explain and understanding who a process of eats away at the MC of nerves has becomes natural process for the perception of immune system information/analysis
1- Something “not a natural part form the genetic system” gives false working order to the immune system make it eats away at the myelin coating of nerves,this is happen outside the control of the genetic system itself

  • External factor,strange thing "parasite " linking with nerves material and becomes a part from the myline coating of nerves (the parasite hidden itself in the myline coating of nerves)
    -therefore,the immune system sensors will perceive both of the parasite factor and the myline coating of nerves as a Single Enemy
    BY some way, the immune system has receives the signs that has been broadcasting form the myelin coating of nerves as an enemy signs (strange) !

  • something was happened makes the basic structure of the parasite is like the myline coating of nerves,or similarity of signs outputs of MC of nerves and parasite

Or,something (germ) linking with the immune system structure itself and becomes a part from it,using the immune system of the host to achieving it life circle,sending strange output sign from the myline coating of nerves which translating into an enemy sign by immune system,then the immune system will giving working order to eat the MC of nerves, whereas the germ functions itself is a specific function to execution the eating process ,it means the eating process is the way to achieving the life circle of germ through delusion the immune system !
the breakfast is served by immune system to the stranger !

OR the parasite has going directly to eating the cell inputs,outputs or the mylien coating of nerves to achieving his life circle ,the process is happens outside the immune system itself, and this means that the immune system is not responsible -and can not receives the signs of the stranger
2- Internal factor,There is a negative mutation in the genetic system,make it giving wrong working order…etc
All what i said is just a words,imagination because i am not an eyewitness for this disease

In sums,the cause may be External factor or Internal ,and there are radical difference between them

You said" the immune system eats away at the MC of nerves…etc)
1- the content of this statement is a description “objective reading” for a “main” symptom,not a description for the cause ( disease)
2- the existential manifest structure /function of the cause will presentation the phenomenon that be called the “disease”,the cause and disease are united phenomenon “single thing in nature”,
both are different about the symptoms which classify as the symptoms of disease ( for example, the virus is different about the symptoms of flu disease )

  • in the case ,if you talk about viral disease ,you must using word “virus” instead of using word " disease" in the statement ,because the disease potential condition is the cause itself,while symptoms is the result of cause functions in our human nature
    -the cause is the disease ,therefor disposal the symptoms is not disposal the cause (disease)
  • in the genetic diseases,the healthy condition,the disease condition and the treatment are single thing in nature ( the gene -the cause)

#36

This thread is going off the rails. It’s nothing to do with naben .


#37

I don’t mean “eats” in a literal sense. MS causes the body to attack its own tissues, primarily the myelin coating on nerves. They do not yet know why, but there are some known risk factors, like vitamin D deficiency, childhood obesity, infections, and about 200 genes have been identified. It’s mysterious, but it certainly is a real disease, or if you prefer, illness.

Yeah this has gotten far afield from Naben. If you’re curious about MS, there is an MS society website.


#38

Thanks to explain my misunderstanding of word “eat”, as you know this not my mother language.

But to explain the symptom “body attacks its own tissues” according to your description,there are 2 main causes;
1-the first is genetic ( about 200 genes),
2-the second is an external factors including " vitamin D deficiency,childhood obesity,infections…"

In my point of view, I think its is smartness infection producing by smart factor,the problem in the impossibility to diagnosing a corporeal structural features of this factor in the body

Therefore,you notice a functional behavior output non familiar in nature "body attacks its own tissues),this is without diagnosing tangible cause (material/organic) -

This symptom is like schizophrenia which it is seems wrongly to the observers as "body/brain attacks its own thoughts,memory events,social relationships linkages, religious/spiritual beliefs…etc while in reality there is an actual smart factor (externally because it is not a part from body/brain/conscious mind) attacks the thoughts,retrospected memory events,the religious belief,the social relations linkages,the current imaginary pictures,the current emotional condition …etc
And we can describe/explain the setup/tactic of the attack mechanisms of the Sz smart factor,but in all cases, all external observers are unable to diagnosing the smart factor by naked eyes or discover the smart factor by lab methods

in other world,about 1% of public are the human beings who can see,hear,touch and coexistence with the smart factor effects,while 99% of public forever are unable to see /hear or touch the smart factor ,because the smart factor has adapted in the structure /function to working in the psychological side ( it means practically ,the smart factor attacks the conscious mind,thinking process, the thoughts content, the feelings, potential emotion state…etc)
I.e the structure/function of smart factor is like/similar the structure/function of the psychological side,you know the impossibility to monitor the inner content of higher knowledge processes that has running in the conscious mind or the the conscious brain-in any period of time !
The sz is a smartness game between ghostly germ and the human psychological entity

Most dangerous genetic disease producing by specific single gene (individual cause)
In any condition,if you can not find individual cause,it is easy to believe in many casual factors ,then you will be fail to have individual causality relationships linking between the observed symptoms and the characters of many different casual factors (each one of them have different/contrary characters about the other factors- like childhood obesity/infections and 200 genes ) !!


#39

Yeah, it’s complicated. Like, women who get flu while pregnant are more likely to have kids with schizophrenia. But it’s just an increased risk, it doesn’t mean 100% you will get schizophrenia. Even the highest known single mutation genetic risk, 22q11.2 deletion only gets you around a 30% chance of developing schizophrenia. But just because there is no single risk factor, like for MS, like for autism, like for Alzheimer’s - which also have no single risk factor - it doesn’t mean the disease is not real.

For that matter, cancer, heart disease and diabetes have many many risk factors, outside of being exposed to a nuclear meltdown, you might be perfectly fine with 2, 5, 10 risk factors, or you might get sick and only have 1 or two known risk factors. The illness is real even if its causes are multifactorial.


#40

Thank you ,because you display many biological factors,it seems you have insist to know the real truth of Sz and many other phenomena.
For my own knowledge,I know what sz is,the case/cause,effect,result …etc,be able to describe everything related the internal logic,I know its mission impossible for anyone but not for me

Let me explain , why everything be complicated related the knowledge issue of schizophrenia?
Most researchers have working to find the cause/causes of schizophrenia without they know what is schizophrenia itself !
you will be fail to find causes,in the case if you do not know the potential nature of the phenomenon ? …WHY ?

Simple subjective cause explains the repeated failure;
1- it is supposed that,the phenomenon is the disease condition
2- the disease condition is the cause itself (united)
Sz condition itself and the Cause itself ARE the Disease Condition itself and dismiss all observed symptoms !

Therefor,when we ask anyone: what is schizophrenia ?
it is supposed that he will describe the the basic characteristics of the cause itself and dismiss the talking about the diagnostic symptoms whatever they are ,because the cause (actor) is not the symptoms (result)
you will find that,everyone has insists to talking about the symptoms of schizophrenia instead to talking about the cause itself (in reality he has no idea what is it) , and he thinks he knows what sz is as long as he can monitor its symptoms !!
,in reality all diagnostic symptoms are the End Results of sz (like flu symptoms)
Even the imbalance state in the mental chemistry is a result of Sz cause effect !

If we ask you : what is the genetic disease-in general ?
you will talking about the characteristics of fit gene ,the defective gene and its real responsibility to causation the healthy condition and the disease condition-you will do that without talking about the symptoms,
Can you do that if we ask you what is schizophrenia -in general !
It is seems simple question,but in reality the answer is mission impossible
In practice,if you think the sz is genetic disease;
What is the characteristics of fit gene or/defective gene and the schizophrenia heath condition ?–
You know there are endless imaginary answers -no more

The questions you ask,the data of experiments and results will building on your previous knowing of the nature of condition
for example,if you think sz is genetic disease,you will search about defective gene,if it is a viral disease you will focus your tests to find the virus…etc,whereas the defected gene is the disease condition and the cause in the same time !!
it must be there is a full corresponding between the experiment data, theoretical concept of disease condition and the actual cause
Question;why hundreds genetic tests do nothing through 100 years ?
the theoretical concept for sz nature is not corresponding with the mother nature !

The sz mother nature is appears itself to both the person/ or the external observers in deceitful manifest,it seems itself for public notifications as a result of inherited condition - but in reality is not inherited at all (a schizophrenic not born but made in the present by action of sz cause everyday)

The main problem of science: the theoretical concept of disease condition do not corresponding with the mother cause itself
There is one way to know the basic mother nature of schizophrenia case/cause,to know exactly the characteristics of the existential features that be seen,heard,touched ,felt and coexisted by the person with Sz-do that without any false interpretation

With all respect to the risk factors,most researchers focus on the risk factors because they can not find the Cause factor ,in practice all possible risk factors unable to development any schizophrenia,and notice that sz does not occurs in the space ,it is occurs inside the anatomical structure ,the psychological component in the existence of all external conditions,therefore it must be there is a bilateral interactions between these factors and the sz case/cause and symptoms